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21 April 2006

Parenthood: Yesterday vs Today

Faith's tantrum has been getting more and more out of control lately and  I find my own fuse burning closer and closer to the detonator.

My wife and I are at odds' end pertaining to how to deal with Faith's nonsense.

In the red corner, is dad and his firm old-school belief that one shouldn't spare the rod and spoil the child. In the blue corner and we have mom who religiously subscribe to all the new age stuff about bringing up a child.

For me, I am not saying that everything is just whack, whack, whack but what I feel that Faith needs, is to be hantam jialat jialat one time just so that she would understand how terok the consequences would be if she does something wrong. Just that one time where the memory of it shall serve as a deterrent for the rest of her childhood.

To take an extreme example. When a person knows that trafficking narcotics in Singapore is punishable by death, wouldn't this person think twice before committing the crime?

Sometimes these people break the law not because they are not scared of the law but rather that they don't know what it would cost them when the law catches up on them.

Anyway, like I said, extreme example lah, since Faith's tantrum is no where nearly as serious as drug trafficking.

The wife has all these theories about educating the child via reasoning, getting into the child's psychology and all the new and modern fancy fandangos.

While I am not belittling new age teachings, I can't help but have my doubts over certain aspects of it.

Here's why.

Back in the day when we were kids, we were whacked left, right and center. You name it, most of us would probably have gone through it. Rotan, feather duster, rulers, back scratchers, broomsticks, kneel, squat, corner, locked room, house arrest are just some of the examples that I am sure would trigger your childhood memory somewhat.

Now look at the kids today. You see kids talking back to their elders disrespectfully, swearing and/or screaming profanities at their parents, making false allegations against teachers, fighting back etc.

While I am not saying the ALL kids today are like that but I am sure you would agree that we see more of these cases that when we were kids ourselves.

So pardon me if I make the connection between modern child upbringing methods and the state of today's kids.


Kids today are so much smarter than before. They now how to manipulate the system to work for them. A whack by the teacher and a report of physically abuse is made against the teacher to the Ministry of Education. The result is the teacher going into the oblivion of suspension pending investigation.

Another case was that of a problem student whom the Principal was spending extra time to help him and ended up being suspended pending investigation for molest. Granted that the results of the investigation cleared the Principal of the allegation but imagine the hell that the Principal himself got dragged through the mud and the various mickey mouse media making a total meal out of it.

The principal in question here was none other than ACS (Barker Road)'s Mr Ng Eng Chin, whom during my day was my Discipline Master. This was one guy who we totally respect since young for he has earned it from us. I still remember him fondly till this very day and quite a few of us stood by him during the ordeal. His character was never in doubt and we were most disgusted at how this errant student was making a mockery of such a person of good standing.

Anyway, my point is that we never had this problem when we were kids and most of us grew up to be pretty well brought up. Then we see the kids of today, running amok all over the place.

Perhaps, it would be wiser not to place one's entire faith blindly into the modern teachings of child upbringing. I firmly believe that some of the essence of the old teachings are still worth preserving and we should combine them with the new ideas stemming from the modern teachings that we find worthy of our implementation.

- Voxeros

1. koreanhousewife left...
Friday, 21 April 2006 1:23 am :: http://www.koreanhousewife.blogspot.com/
BIG (as in the movie),
I still say I am all rooted for canning (whether its to kids or adults)
Have a taste of fire, and you know wat is fire.


2. Sallie left...
Friday, 21 April 2006 1:54 am
OMG - you just opened a big can of worms.. I can talk long long, with plenty of examples. The consolation is, you will realise that all students across the world of this generation are the same (give or take a few). btw, I've just seen a streaming of the interview with LKY. I just wish they had better prepared their questions and had more depth to it. They came across as young grandchildren talking to a grand dad!! grr. what a bloody waste of time.


3. jettykey left...
Friday, 21 April 2006 2:04 am
I say rotan, but with reason. No pain no gain. I'm appalled with kids' behaviour nowadays. Hopefully Faith will appreciate when she's older.


4. JayWalk left...
Friday, 21 April 2006 8:40 am ::
KoreanHouseWife: That WAS my point exactly!! Glad SOMEBODY understood.

SALlie: I just gotten hold of the clip and will be watching it today. Perhaps later I would have something to say about it.

Jettykey: Rotan with Reason is right. Rotan without reason and the kid will learn to rebel against the rotan now and authority next.
Before whacking, it is imperative that the kid is convinced that he/she deserved the whacking.


5. Chris left...
Friday, 21 April 2006 1:51 pm
Try watching some episodes of Super Nanny.


6. akk left...
Friday, 21 April 2006 3:06 pm
i had to deal with some undergraduates sometimes in the teaching arena and am also disgusted by their lack of respect irregardless to who they are talking to, but damn shitty, becos you cannot hamtam them anymore and the lecturers keep saying they are our 'customers' now. I fucking hate that word. They are fuckling not customers and they are still fucking rude to a teacher/mentor/prof/lecturer. this is totally uncalled for, there is no point in being rude/short-tempered and out of control. a learning institution is suppose to instill learning, not contend with bad/aggressive behavior. having them as customers just throws the whole aim of education out the fricking window. where then will we be able to churn out solid, reasonable logical adults for the working society if we have to stomach their lack of etiquette and basic courtesy?
I don't know how you are able to get your point across to your wife and kids, but i wish you all the very best, because I would feel it so wasted if a child will grow up to be like one of those jerks in school that i meet...


7. heather left...
Friday, 21 April 2006 4:01 pm
aiyoh, don't whack la.. small girl.. teach slowly. The other kids no manners doesn't mean your kid will be the same if don't whack right? sigh.. I think it takes a lot of time to teach them the right things and perhaps, nowadays kids are just spoiled.. parents give them whatever they want so other people don't, they start to rebel and talk back..


8. JayWalk left...
Friday, 21 April 2006 6:17 pm :: 
Chris: Are you who I think you are?
Anyway, welcome to the first comment.
I have seen a number of episodes of Super Nanny and I can tell you that it is utter BULLSHIT.
This TV series is edited and I bet that for every successful episode that was aired, there are 10 takes that failed and ended up in the rubbish bin.
Unless the show was done "live", this show itself lacked credibility.
Think about this for a while. In order to achieve a higher success rate, don't you think that the target families would have been pre-screened by the producers ahead of selection?
Can you say, referee Kelong?


9. JayWalk left...
Friday, 21 April 2006 6:18 pm ::
akk: Problem with these young punks is that they think that the world revolves around them, having been pampered and spoilt since young.

Heather: If you think about it, whacking is also part of the teaching. Again, I need to reiterate that whacking is only as a very very very last resort.
You are right in the sense that parents have to shoulder part of the responsibility pertaining to their spoiled brats.
I have seen too many parents taking the easy way out by bribing the kids in order to get them to behave.
After a while, the kid will learn that he has to make a big ruckus if he wants something from the parents. If this the message that we want to get across to the child?
Some may turn it around and say that I am using the whacking as the easy way out.
That may not be untrue but at least the kid would not turn out to be a whiny brat.
Even if they end up rebellious machiam gangster, at least the kid grow up to be tough and strong rather than some soft, whiny self-centered brat.
Ok ok, so perhaps that was a very extremely example.
I like my kids to not only be brought up well but also to be brought up tough and strong.


10. ris left...
Friday, 21 April 2006 7:41 pm
why dont you just buy a cane, show it to her and show her how deep a mark it leaves on a sofa. then tell her if she misbehaves she'll get it. if she still misbehaves, then ... explain & rotan.


11. kim left...
Friday, 21 April 2006 10:21 pm
i think sparing the rod is bullshit.
Yesterday I was watching this episode of SuperNanny, and the kids were so 恐怖 that I seriously pitied the parents. Makes me think twice about having kids at all. And I thought my mei was bad. 小巫见大巫。
Somehow, kids nowadays are getting ridiculous. (I'm no longer a kid, so I can say them! muahaha..) And I think it's 'cause of the westernised thinking of sparing the rod. Not all westernized ways are good/efficient/effective. If I were to ever have a child, I will make sure I will not spare the rotan, and make sure that they understand why I'm using the rotan on them.
It's hard being a parent, isnt it? 左右为难。Haha..


12. Lynne left...
Friday, 21 April 2006 10:26 pm
For those out there who are contemplating having kids, let this be a learning experience - DO NOT have children. My sis is being driven up the wall by her 2 gals, and they are not even trafficking drugs yet! Haha. You'll never catch me having one of those rascals!


13. JayWalk left...
Friday, 21 April 2006 11:31 pm :: 
ris: I guess I dragged my feet on buying the cane. I supposed it's intentional procrastination on my part.

kim: Like I said, Super Nanny is bullshit.

Lynne: I look forward to the day when you need to put that foot in your mouth when you have to go shopping for the baby car seat to put in your new minivan. Hah!


14. Jaslyn left...
Saturday, 22 April 2006 12:17 am :: http://precious-jas.blogspot.com
I remember hating my parents when they cane me. Esp over silly things like my brother fell down himself!! And me coughing out the cough syrup cos I was really coughing so badly the cough mixture made me puke! Like that also cane me? Song meh?
I also remember being locked up in the dark storeroom. (of cos I wasn't tall enuf to reach the switch for the light and was aldy crying like mad)
U see.. We can forgive but we can never forget. So, cane or not? Yes and No. Make her remember, yes, I can guaranty u this. Make her a good girl? Hard to say. Some people eat soft, don't eat hard one. The harder treatment u give, the harder she'll bite onto it!
I have a feeling that Faith's character quite like me. Be careful wor Papa J! Jia liat liao! hahaa


15. koreanhousewife left...
Saturday, 22 April 2006 2:27 am :: http://www.koreanhousewife.blogspot.com/
BIG ROD (as in cane lah...),
I think sometime relationship is a two way traffic. For some, yr notty kids might be a reflection of U. Cos sometimes I see those MONSTERS, and look at their mom and pop. My tot bubble will be: NO WONDER!
One of my postin at my blog I mentioned abt a MONSTER at the MRT. I guess tis kind of image is not totally new to alot of people...
I seriously DETEST (sorri have to CAPS cos feel berri strongly abt tis mah...) parents whom themself do not set a gd example. I means if U LIKE TAT, how I respect U? Tats my take...
Its like U notice some parents will just barked: WOU DA NEI HUH? (sorri hanyu means I beat U ar! right?)...or screamed: I ask POLICE to catch U. Damn it lahits like SAY SAY SAY but NEVER action.
I hate tis KINDI tell U....Say for the sake of sayin. To me, I say ONE means ONE, TWO means TWO. If I say and U dont STOP, then I will seriously whack!
U know why sometimes kids will go on and on for the nonesense cos they parents like NATO (no action talk only)....then they where got scare? Still continue their tantrum throwin lor.
My take will be. I love U and shower U with love. How come U treat me back like tat and throw tantrum. Wat have I done to deserve yr ill treatment. So when I feel, its over the line/fire. I will DO IT.
Also does call POLICE and catch U make sense. Damn stupid lor.
Anyway If I have kids,I want them to have the basic manner. My wish for them is to be brave and also go for their dreams and be bold and outspoken. To be berri vocal and not like a timid mouse...So sendin them for oversea studies is preffered.
But there again, I know I wont have kids and Jay, U know my reasonsI guess I will never be able to share my toys collect with my blood. Its ok, have afew parrots, dogs and koi can liao:P


16. JayWalk left...
Saturday, 22 April 2006 8:44 am ::
Jaslyn: Hence my reluctance to really use the cane. Perhaps now you realised why I am dragging my feet over it?

KoreanHouseWife: Scaring the kid into thinking that police will catch is not dumb as long as the kid can be fooled into believing it i.e. small kid - ok, 18 year-old - not so ok.
You are right in saying that we sometimes just have to look at the parents to realised why the kids are brats. It's been more than a generation already.


17. koreanhousewife left...
Saturday, 22 April 2006 10:03 am :: http://www.koreanhousewife.blogspot.com/
Cane U then U know,
Where got say: Police catch U to 18yo one! For tat kind must say: Rape U!. (ok, jokin).
Again I stress, must train them since young. Foundation right then later will all fall into gd place.
P/S: U notice since I know U, I always type: FOUNDATION so many times at MSN. The foundation is NOT the make up 1cm hor!


18. koreanhousewife left...
Saturday, 22 April 2006 10:09 am :: http://www.koreanhousewife.blogspot.com/
How many strokes?,
I forgot to add. I have afew mate’s hubby are police officer, they were got time to catch kids. They everyday and nite have to type: REPORT REPORT (fingers must be damn stiff and fast typin)...
The point is, using POLICE man and scare them in tis manner is wrong teachin. First, paint a black pix of those officer. Also I dont believe in instortin fear in kids by verbal. If really mean it, and over the board, then whack. Not need to say so much kind. Sorri if I so violent queen. Cos I see too many parents NATO, I damn sian!


19. JayWalk left...
Saturday, 22 April 2006 4:39 pm :: 
KoreanHouseWife: The instilling fear method is a way where the parents are hoping that the kid would think twice before committing the "crime".
Hence saving the parents the need to really have to whack the kid.
No parent (non-abusive ones) would sukah sukah whack their kids one lah.


20. koreanhousewife left...
Saturday, 22 April 2006 8:14 pm :: http://www.koreanhousewife.blogspot.com/
Please spank me,
Ok, I have nothing more to add liao:P Too young and inexperience to dish...


21. Mum2One left...
Saturday, 22 April 2006 8:36 pm
so, have u and wife come to a compromise as to how to treat her tantrums coz they'll be very confused if you're both not on the same page about what to do. still waitin 4 cyclone to come*haiz*. will keep u informed.


22. JayWalk left...
Saturday, 22 April 2006 9:08 pm ::
Mum2One: Yeah. So for now, I just let the wife take care of the discipline.
Coz by the time, it comes to me, it would be the BIG thrashing.


23. Chris left...
Monday, 24 April 2006 1:36 pm
Probably yes, I am who you think I am. We escaped from Monkey Island together.
Urr.. ok.. I agree that Super nanny is too good to be true. But also they did not claim that every home she goes to is corrected well. More like they show the good, but hide the bad. But there are still some things that we can draw from there. I will take the measured approach, use my nut head to learn the good things from the good, and to recognise the bad things from the bad. Yes, the Hall of Justice did not and still does not exist. ie. Don't believe everything you see on TV.


24. JayWalk left...
Monday, 24 April 2006 6:24 pm :: 
Chris: I guessed as much. Glad to have you aboard!
Queston 1: If a wood chuck could chuck wood, how much wood would a wood chuck chuck?

Ok, coming back to this topic. While I will not discredit the the effectiveness of the methods, I just don't like the impression where they portray as 100% success rate.
I would appreciate if the show could also show failed attempts.
It just riled me to see everything all so rosy and peachy.
Bah humbug!


25. aloe left...
Tuesday, 25 April 2006 8:37 am
They would NEVER show the failed attempts. It would go against the title.... SUPER nanny mah... how can she fail!!! Then the people out there would lose their 'hopes'. heh! But I do think that there is always a learning opportunity and in this show, you do get to learn some methods of teaching your kids in future.


26. JayWalk left...
Tuesday, 25 April 2006 12:37 pm ::
Anna: If every time also success, machiam kelong leh. I think the show would be more endearing if they occasionally show a failed attempt, just to keep it real.
But then hor, the "failed family" would be damn malu given that the episode would have been aired all over the world.

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